===== Open Log 2008-07-13T</p> <p> 21:10:15.860423Z =====
</p> <p> 21:10:28 Nostrum Forder: made low-ball offers over and over until they got tired
</p> <p> 21:10:31 Winter Wardhani: (waiting for you all to rezz so I can sit, sorry)
</p> <p> 21:10:34 Kyrion Yalin: take a seat Winter
</p> <p> 21:10:36 Jeffrey Gomez: Hey, neat. Someone resurrected the "Ad Farms?" forum thread.
</p> <p> 21:10:40 Nostrum Forder: Encroachment, usually
</p> <p> 21:10:42 Talarus Luan: Sounds like me in Great Pubnico
</p> <p> 21:10:46 Talarus Luan: I wear them down
</p> <p> 21:10:47 Nostrum Forder: In some cases, they had ban lines up
</p> <p> 21:10:54 Nostrum Forder: I just AR over and over and over.
</p> <p> 21:11:03 Nostrum Forder: ANd file tickets
</p> <p> 21:11:15 Nostrum Forder: the funiest was when I AR'd the Governor.
</p> <p> 21:11:20 Timo Daehlie: lol
</p> <p> 21:11:25 Jeffrey Gomez: I suspect next Jack's we'll hear from them about how we abuse the AR system.
</p> <p> 21:11:30 Nostrum Forder: conceirge contacted me, said "are you for real"
</p> <p> 21:11:34 Jeffrey Gomez: Etc. Etc.
</p> <p> 21:11:48 Timo Daehlie: maybe we should start an AR campaign
</p> <p> 21:11:52 Talarus Luan: Well, AR spam usually gets you ignored.
</p> <p> 21:11:56 Nostrum Forder: I said "Governour holds 4x4s I have a full surround on with banlines.
</p> <p> 21:12:04 Nostrum Forder: Oh, I don't spam.
</p> <p> 21:12:06 Jeffrey Gomez: ARing the Governor is fair game only when there's tree encroachment. :p
</p> <p> 21:12:19 Talarus Luan: All you have to do with Gov Linden like that is ask for it, and they sell it to you for L$1/sqm
</p> <p> 21:12:34 Nostrum Forder: Maintenance land with ban lines gets her ARd
</p> <p> 21:12:39 Nostrum Forder: period.
</p> <p> 21:12:44 Rem Nightfire: hi esther wb
</p> <p> 21:12:46 Jeffrey Gomez: o_O
</p> <p> 21:12:50 Talarus Luan: Well, that actually won't fix the problem
</p> <p> 21:12:55 Jeffrey Gomez: Yep.
</p> <p> 21:12:56 Esther Merryman: sorry crashed
</p> <p> 21:12:58 Nostrum Forder: did for me.
</p> <p> 21:13:06 Lennox Larkham: can you plant a tree on your land and the tree go into the signs
</p> <p> 21:13:10 Jeffrey Gomez: And I wasn't aware banlines "stuck" when plots were released.
</p> <p> 21:13:13 Talarus Luan: at least not very quickly. There is a method for dealing with Gov Linden land which will get it fixed real quick
</p> <p> 21:13:45 Talarus Luan: What has been happening is that people are abandoning microplots, and the perms stay set
</p> <p> 21:13:52 Rem Nightfire: it looks like the Gov is snatching up lots of small plots and joining them
</p> <p> 21:13:58 Jeffrey Gomez: That seems kinda... dumb.
</p> <p> 21:14:01 Talarus Luan: The reclamation process does get them cleaned, but abandoning does not
</p> <p> 21:14:26 Talarus Luan: It's a known issue that Jack mentioned before that they are trying to get fixed.
</p> <p> 21:15:02 Awenina Ethaniel: what is AR?
</p> <p> 21:15:07 Talarus Luan: Abuse Report
</p> <p> 21:15:10 Awenina Ethaniel: ah ok
</p> <p> 21:15:47 Rem Nightfire: several new cutters on the scene as well
</p> <p> 21:16:03 Lennox Larkham: i have filed ar's and nothing going on never here back
</p> <p> 21:16:08 Awenina Ethaniel: bummer... I have to go :( hope to get back before meeting is over.
</p> <p> 21:16:19 Talarus Luan: Starting out with the News from the Front item.... (since we are already there)
</p> <p> 21:16:24 Timo Daehlie: you have 2 hours ;)
</p> <p> 21:16:34 Movies1963 Beck: may I ask a qustion?
</p> <p> 21:16:37 Talarus Luan: Rem, what do you have?
</p> <p> 21:16:42 Talarus Luan: Sure, Movies
</p> <p> 21:16:45 Movies1963 Beck: are you people against adfarms or you just are against adfarms that boarder your properties?
</p> <p> 21:16:53 Rem Nightfire: marcantonio vella is cutting like crazy
</p> <p> 21:17:07 Timo Daehlie: all ad farms movies ;)
</p> <p> 21:17:14 Kyrion Yalin: to answer you movies, i have no land in mainland
</p> <p> 21:17:20 Movies1963 Beck: I'm asking because I dont know how they hurt people in here
</p> <p> 21:17:42 Rem Nightfire: i also see lots of individuals - mostly from the islands - putting up ads to advertise their pristine spaces
</p> <p> 21:17:58 Talarus Luan: We are against the practice all over the mainland, because we are all neighbors and friends here.
</p> <p> 21:18:23 Lennox Larkham: these people are doing this for things money and to be mean they get off on it
</p> <p> 21:18:28 Talarus Luan: Because adfarms are present everywhere
</p> <p> 21:18:31 lufpleh Obstreperous: its a scenic/landscape blight thing I think
</p> <p> 21:18:58 Talarus Luan: and when people pay them off or buy them out, they appear in our backyards
</p> <p> 21:19:04 Rem Nightfire: y are you here beck?
</p> <p> 21:19:07 Nostrum Forder: I for one am not against 4x4 parcels per se. They have their place.
</p> <p> 21:19:10 Rem Nightfire: *why
</p> <p> 21:19:</p> <p> 21 Talarus Luan: Pick up a copy of the War FAQ from the red cone there
</p> <p> 21:19:26 Movies1963 Beck: trying to understand the argument against them is all
</p> <p> 21:19:36 Nostrum Forder: I am against having 4x4s that disrupt the landscape.
</p> <p> 21:19:44 Rem Nightfire: well then you should sit and listen
</p> <p> 21:20:00 Movies1963 Beck: Rem dont condesend to me
</p> <p> 21:20:23 Rem Nightfire: im not but if you want to learn its the best way
</p> <p> 21:20:26 Movies1963 Beck: when you see me asking a qustion it's an inteligent one
</p> <p> 21:20:28 Lennox Larkham: when you buy land and they see you have something you have put alot of time into and the $ thats when they start pushing it
</p> <p> 21:20:49 Talarus Luan: Alright folks. We're friends here. :) Questions are fine, and there is plenty of info here on the table to answer them, and time for us to answer any which our matierials don't address.
</p> <p> 21:</p> <p> 21:08 Winter Wardhani: imagine buying a land with sea view for instance, Movie, and the next day you have a big column of ads, lagging everything and stopping you to sit on the porche. And to get the view back u have to pay 10k for 64 sqm
</p> <p> 21:</p> <p> 21:19 Talarus Luan: The War FAQ is very comprehensive and explains many things about our movement.
</p> <p> 21:</p> <p> 21:36 Timo Daehlie: wb drake ;)
</p> <p> 21:</p> <p> 21:43 Mandrake Araw: thanks timo :-)
</p> <p> 21:</p> <p> 21:50 Esther Merryman: movies i am against people using a small plot to extort people surrounding them
</p> <p> 21:</p> <p> 21:58 Drongle McMahon: Mov .. it's because most of them are fundamentally used for extortion by the threat of spoiling otjher people's enjoyment of SL.
</p> <p> 21:22:06 Esther Merryman: and i think that goes for everyone here
</p> <p> 21:22:16 Askew Aeon: hello all
</p> <p> 21:22:20 Timo Daehlie: hi askew ;)
</p> <p> 21:22:23 Esther Merryman: i personally dont uderstand adfarms
</p> <p> 21:22:28 Movies1963 Beck: ok, that's understandable
</p> <p> 21:22:32 Rem Nightfire: hi askew
</p> <p> 21:22:44 Jeffrey Gomez: Esther: Think of it as similar to the economics of spam.
</p> <p> 21:22:50 Askew Aeon: sorry seam i did miss some lol
</p> <p> 21:22:54 Talarus Luan: Alright. Anything else to add, Rem?
</p> <p> 21:22:57 Esther Merryman: as when bunched together surely they are no use for advertising or extortion
</p> <p> 21:23:16 Lennox Larkham: right
</p> <p> 21:23:23 Rem Nightfire: no thats it
</p> <p> 21:23:44 Talarus Luan: Okies.
</p> <p> 21:23:56 Talarus Luan: One quick item from me from last week.
</p> <p> 21:24:06 Drongle McMahon: Esther .. it's so that when you buy out one with something nasty on it, they can put the same thing on the next one and extort you some more.
</p> <p> 21:24:28 Lennox Larkham: they do this to be mean just like in real life
</p> <p> 21:24:49 Drongle McMahon: Not just to be mean, but to take your money.
</p> <p> 21:24:53 Esther Merryman: yes but surely the cost becomes so great it is no longer practical to buy them
</p> <p> 21:24:57 Lennox Larkham: yes
</p> <p> 21:24:58 Talarus Luan: I apologize for my unscheduled absence, but it does illustrate again that this movement is more important than any one person or group. We're all in this together, so no matter who may drive the efforts, we are all responsible for its success. :)
</p> <p> 21:25:25 Herne Diker: I think they think SL is a joke and they'll dredge dollars out of the johns here.
</p> <p> 21:25:43 Esther Merryman: i am in the procces of setting up a direction for land purchase
</p> <p> 21:25:50 Talarus Luan: Yes, they take it only as serious as necessary for them to profit.
</p> <p> 21:25:56 Drongle McMahon: The occasional successful extortion can pay the tier for hundreds of plots many times over.
</p> <p> 21:26:00 Rem Nightfire: and i apologize for overstepping in my comment to beck questions are important, but i felt they were distracting
</p> <p> 21:26:05 Timo Daehlie: they dont have a clue how those clowns operate anywat
</p> <p> 21:26:11 Esther Merryman: if people use the view and land owners the lines show the number of small plots
</p> <p> 21:26:</p> <p> 21 Talarus Luan: Is OK. We're not 100% formal in the meeting here. :) RRR is not in effect.
</p> <p> 21:26:37 Talarus Luan: Err. RRO
</p> <p> 21:26:44 Esther Merryman: simple as that
</p> <p> 21:26:45 Talarus Luan: Robert's Rules of Order. ;)
</p> <p> 21:26:47 Esther Merryman: lots of small plots dont buy land near them
</p> <p> 21:27:19 Talarus Luan: OK. The big news this week came from Jack Linden's office hours.
</p> <p> 21:27:22 Esther Merryman: LL will have to act
</p> <p> 21:27:24 Esther Merryman: when great swathes of land are left unsold
</p> <p> 21:27:27 Rem Nightfire: yes
</p> <p> 21:27:45 Talarus Luan: It appears that the Lindens have been staffing up the Concierge and mainland governance team.
</p> <p> 21:28:00 Nostrum Forder: /me grins
</p> <p> 21:28:01 Nostrum Forder: good.
</p> <p> 21:28:09 Talarus Luan: .. in preparation for some new policy that they are rolling out to address the adfarm/extortionist problem
</p> <p> 21:28:15 Nostrum Forder: I just tiered up to concierge.
</p> <p> 21:28:18 Lennox Larkham: there are no rules or laws for the add farmer linden needs to put there laws down and gt on with it
</p> <p> 21:28:26 Lennox Larkham: get
</p> <p> 21:28:35 Herne Diker: I contacted the native american groups that BTE puts on their monstrous signs
</p> <p> 21:28:38 Talarus Luan: Well, supposedly, that is what is going to happen. We don't know what yet
</p> <p> 21:28:46 Rem Nightfire: yes so did i
</p> <p> 21:29:11 Talarus Luan: We hope it will be a good rule, full of teeth that put the bite on the adfarmers and extortionists.
</p> <p> 21:29:16 Herne Diker: to validate themselves and they were furious that their copyright were being abused without their knowledge.
</p> <p> 21:29:27 Lennox Larkham: native americans dont promote pono do they
</p> <p> 21:29:29 Talarus Luan: Oh, that is great. :)
</p> <p> 21:29:33 Timo Daehlie: cool Herne ;)
</p> <p> 21:29:45 Talarus Luan: Did you tell them she was taking donations for them?
</p> <p> 21:29:49 Timo Daehlie: can you keep us up to date about that ?
</p> <p> 21:29:51 Esther Merryman: i am tiering up to as i think it will help in service issues across the board
</p> <p> 21:29:57 Esther Merryman: not just adfarming
</p> <p> 21:30:05 Rem Nightfire: i did not get a response did you write to AIM herne?
</p> <p> 21:30:08 Herne Diker: yes AIM is going to tlk law with them.
</p> <p> 21:30:14 Talarus Luan: I bet that would piss them off bigtime.
</p> <p> 21:30:16 Rem Nightfire: great
</p> <p> 21:30:20 Lennox Larkham: i can see her sign from were iam sitting even as i speak
</p> <p> 21:30:25 Nostrum Forder: Anyone deal with Wispy Broome at all?
</p> <p> 21:30:27 Drongle McMahon: Excellent news
</p> <p> 21:30:30 Talarus Luan: Yep. Just to the west
</p> <p> 21:30:47 Nostrum Forder: Ever get them to trade or sell?
</p> <p> 21:30:51 Herne Diker: I encased three sides of her sign with mega prims. I didn't know what else to do.
</p> <p> 21:31:02 Rem Nightfire: thats what you do
</p> <p> 21:31:05 Talarus Luan: I contacted ShopNBC and Sharper Image, but have only gotten back form letters acknowledging my emails
</p> <p> 21:31:37 Talarus Luan: Will try to contact them via voice this week and get a real abuse department rep
</p> <p> 21:31:54 Lennox Larkham: is it allowed to put trees into the sign if the tree is on your land
</p> <p> 21:32:00 Rem Nightfire: fantastic
</p> <p> 21:32:05 Talarus Luan: Anyway, the Jack Linden meeting was very lively, and you can read it all on Prokofy Neva's blog, since she was there.
</p> <p> 21:32:35 Lennox Larkham: i have been looking for this answer for 9 months
</p> <p> 21:32:45 Herne Diker: can prims put on their signs be scripted to redraw as fast as they are returned?
</p> <p> 21:33:33 Talarus Luan: http://secondthoughts.typepad.com/second_thoughts/2008/07/post.html#more
</p> <p> 21:33:38 Nostrum Forder: Talarus, did you post a link to that blog before? I didn't see it
</p> <p> 21:33:44 Nostrum Forder: ah ty
</p> <p> 21:33:45 Herne Diker: Are the Lindens on our side?
</p> <p> 21:33:55 Rem Nightfire: we think so, maybe
</p> <p> 21:34:10 Talarus Luan: They cannot open show support for any one group
</p> <p> 21:34:15 Rem Nightfire: they acknowledge the problem
</p> <p> 21:34:18 Nostrum Forder: If a prim iis centered on your land and crosses the parcel boundary, you are technically encroaching.
</p> <p> 21:34:37 Talarus Luan: However, they seem to listen, if not understand and acknowledge the issues we are bringing to light.
</p> <p> 21:34:45 Esther Merryman: dont do anything they the adfarmers can report you for
</p> <p> 21:34:51 Esther Merryman: they will do
</p> <p> 21:35:00 Talarus Luan: Yes, the entirety of any prim or tree has to be over your land, otherwise you are ARable for encroachment
</p> <p> 21:35:06 Jeffrey Gomez: The Lindens are on the side of whatever creates fewer support problems for them.
</p> <p> 21:35:10 Lennox Larkham: the lindens should not have to take sides just get the laws in place that states no more of the mess
</p> <p> 21:35:16 Jeffrey Gomez: Which would put them on our side, yes.
</p> <p> 21:35:20 Esther Merryman: and linden labs will act imediately as the tiers for adfarmers
</p> <p> 21:35:25 Rem Nightfire: ha, yes
</p> <p> 21:35:36 Talarus Luan: Esther has become experienced with adfarmer ARs. :)
</p> <p> 21:35:39 Esther Merryman: meet the needs for consierge support
</p> <p> 21:35:46 lufpleh Obstreperous: is blocking thier view with a mega prim considered an AR offense (if its totaly on your land)??
</p> <p> 21:35:53 Rem Nightfire: no
</p> <p> 21:35:55 Jeffrey Gomez: Nope.
</p> <p> 21:35:58 Esther Merryman: best to as walls
</p> <p> 21:36:02 Esther Merryman: use
</p> <p> 21:36:04 Jeffrey Gomez: Just as long as it doesn't block their access to the land.
</p> <p> 21:36:10 Jeffrey Gomez: So phantom.
</p> <p> 21:36:19 Lennox Larkham: what about a tree
</p> <p> 21:36:22 Talarus Luan: To our best knowledge, no, but it is subject to consistent enforcement issues
</p> <p> 21:36:29 Rem Nightfire: make it phantom and a bit off the ground
</p> <p> 21:36:47 Rem Nightfire: can be transparent on the inside too if you want to be nice
</p> <p> 21:36:55 Esther Merryman: mega prims are the best way to stop them currently
</p> <p> 21:37:17 Herne Diker: but I had to go up a tier to get the three sides
</p> <p> 21:37:43 Herne Diker: I'd rather get a legal, political solution
</p> <p> 21:37:58 Rem Nightfire: thats reall resolve herne great
</p> <p> 21:38:01 Talarus Luan: Yes, that is what we would like too
</p> <p> 21:38:24 Talarus Luan: However, no solution will be perfect, so I expect we will need to continue to organize.
</p> <p> 21:38:56 Timo Daehlie: more and more get aware of this movement ;)
</p> <p> 21:39:01 Rem Nightfire: yes
</p> <p> 21:39:06 Talarus Luan: This effort is all about getting to know our neighbors and helping one another put an end to land abuse and griefing
</p> <p> 21:39:31 Esther Merryman: did we sort out a contest
</p> <p> 21:39:35 Herne Diker: I dropped notes to all my neighbors and most who responded were ambivalent
</p> <p> 21:39:40 Timo Daehlie: half esther
</p> <p> 21:39:42 Esther Merryman: from the meetings before
</p> <p> 21:39:55 Rem Nightfire: in what way herne?
</p> <p> 21:39:57 Timo Daehlie: tal is working on it with hekate but hekate is also moving out in rl
</p> <p> 21:40:17 Talarus Luan: Yes, Hekate has been putting effort into it. You can see it there on the middle of the table
</p> <p> 21:40:27 Herne Diker: they gave lines like "they're just business people like me"
</p> <p> 21:40:31 Esther Merryman: cool
</p> <p> 21:40:59 Rem Nightfire: wow they dont mind the visual spam near their home?
</p> <p> 21:41:04 Talarus Luan: Heh.. they really need to come out and experience the extortionist/adfarm love
</p> <p> 21:41:08 Esther Merryman: there is nothing wrong with legitimate business
</p> <p> 21:41:15 Rem Nightfire: haha
</p> <p> 21:41:19 Talarus Luan: Is there any in your sim?
</p> <p> 21:41:24 Jeffrey Gomez: It depends on the build, really. Most "indoor" businesses don't notice it as much.
</p> <p> 21:41:30 Esther Merryman: but when its aimed at forcing people into a corner
</p> <p> 21:41:33 Lennox Larkham: sign people sit on there 16sq month after month may be there shoud be some sort of extra charge fo these 16s that they should have to pay every 2 or 3 days
</p> <p> 21:41:41 Herne Diker: they encased their property in walls, balkinazation rather than society
</p> <p> 21:41:45 Jeffrey Gomez: But anyone that has a view to the outside tends to see it more.
</p> <p> 21:41:48 Esther Merryman: using immoral tactics
</p> <p> 21:41:50 Rem Nightfire: i see
</p> <p> 21:41:52 Askew Aeon: u can see from my garden ;)
</p> <p> 21:41:54 Lennox Larkham: make them pay
</p> <p> 21:42:04 Esther Merryman: then a solution is needed to stop it
</p> <p> 21:42:07 Talarus Luan: Yeah, I am sure there will be folks who are indifferent, until it gets right in their face.
</p> <p> 21:42:12 Trinity Coulter: May I propose something?
</p> <p> 21:42:14 Jeffrey Gomez: Yep.
</p> <p> 21:42:16 Talarus Luan: Sure
</p> <p> 21:42:51 Trinity Coulter: instead of all the other proposals, what about specifically zoning parts of a sim for advertising
</p> <p> 21:43:06 Talarus Luan: Which parts?
</p> <p> 21:43:14 Rem Nightfire: that may be part of LL 's ideas
</p> <p> 21:43:17 Talarus Luan: Everyone is going to say NIMBY
</p> <p> 21:43:19 Trinity Coulter: a part
</p> <p> 21:43:</p> <p> 21 Timo Daehlie: x : -150
</p> <p> 21:43:25 Timo Daehlie: z too
</p> <p> 21:43:45 Talarus Luan: "Not In My Back Yard"
</p> <p> 21:43:55 Trinity Coulter: just a certain plot that is specifically ad-allowed
</p> <p> 21:44:10 Talarus Luan: If it was next to your home or business, would you accept that?
</p> <p> 21:44:</p> <p> 21 Esther Merryman: i can see areas along roadways would be a good idea for advertising
</p> <p> 21:44:25 Rem Nightfire: but the size and appearance of the ads need to be regulated as well
</p> <p> 21:44:29 Trinity Coulter: well the facts are that advertising needs an outlet
</p> <p> 21:44:33 Herne Diker: if it was ten m only ok
</p> <p> 21:44:41 Talarus Luan: There are MANY outlets for advertising which don't require what amounts to visual spam
</p> <p> 21:44:46 Esther Merryman: with regulation to limit the sizes
</p> <p> 21:44:49 Rem Nightfire: yes
</p> <p> 21:44:50 Trinity Coulter: where, Talarus/
</p> <p> 21:44:53 Trinity Coulter: ?
</p> <p> 21:44:59 Trinity Coulter: I don't see them now
</p> <p> 21:45:11 Talarus Luan: Look over there *points down along the east wall of the zoo*
</p> <p> 21:45:14 Herne Diker: I don't understand ads in an enviroment where people teleport and the only people to see it are local residents
</p> <p> 21:45:22 Talarus Luan: Exactly, Herne
</p> <p> 21:45:27 Jeffrey Gomez: It makes more sense to give them plots along route 1, welcome areas, and popular gathering areas like sandboxes.
</p> <p> 21:45:33 Rem Nightfire: right and they generally hate them
</p> <p> 21:45:42 Jeffrey Gomez: But then, the goal isn't really advertising in a sane market.
</p> <p> 21:45:48 Esther Merryman: talarus people dont look around for the other forms though
</p> <p> 21:45:51 Trinity Coulter: I don't see what Talarus is referring to
</p> <p> 21:45:53 Talarus Luan: Internally viewable advertising works great
</p> <p> 21:45:56 Lennox Larkham: how about setting a limitation on how many a person could own and if they go over the limit they get fined real heavy by linden corp
</p> <p> 21:46:03 Jeffrey Gomez: It's spamming to collect from companies that fund that. And extortion.
</p> <p> 21:46:06 Rem Nightfire: yes
</p> <p> 21:46:15 Esther Merryman: and i dont think they even take notice of the visual spam ones either
</p> <p> 21:46:25 Askew Aeon: i still dont see how this adds are profitable, did ever one clicked them?
</p> <p> 21:46:29 Herne Diker: they scam companies who know no better?
</p> <p> 21:46:32 lufpleh Obstreperous: lennox, they would just hold them under alt accounts
</p> <p> 21:46:39 Talarus Luan: The venu owner loves it (or it wouldn't be there), the customers don't mind, because it isn't their home, and the advertisers get more positive results because people aren't angry with spam
</p> <p> 21:46:49 Lennox Larkham: dont let them go ther
</p> <p> 21:46:51 Jeffrey Gomez: Additionally, zoning advertising would cut out the middle man for businesses.
</p> <p> 21:46:55 Lennox Larkham: there
</p> <p> 21:46:56 Jeffrey Gomez: Which means all the ad farmers will bitch and whine when it gets implemented.
</p> <p> 21:47:01 Jeffrey Gomez: Not that I mind.
</p> <p> 21:47:03 Rem Nightfire: awwwww
</p> <p> 21:47:04 Lennox Larkham: only one av
</p> <p> 21:47:08 Jeffrey Gomez: They made the gamble, not me.
</p> <p> 21:47:12 Trinity Coulter: I don't see what Talarus was referring to
</p> <p> 21:47:19 Lennox Larkham: and you have to pay for it
</p> <p> 21:47:31 Lennox Larkham: like we all do
</p> <p> 21:47:35 Talarus Luan: See the big orange pointer down there?
</p> <p> 21:47:46 Trinity Coulter: ok
</p> <p> 21:47:55 Talarus Luan: Those are all ads
</p> <p> 21:47:57 Trinity Coulter: that's not at all what I assume is a problem
</p> <p> 21:48:05 Talarus Luan: It isn't. that's the point
</p> <p> 21:48:09 Trinity Coulter: ok
</p> <p> 21:48:17 Trinity Coulter: I was referring to the problem
</p> <p> 21:48:20 Talarus Luan: The neighbors don't go "AUGH! MY EYES!"
</p> <p> 21:48:32 Jeffrey Gomez: Because it's contained.
</p> <p> 21:48:35 Talarus Luan: Because it isn't targeting their viewspace
</p> <p> 21:48:37 Trinity Coulter: and how having zoned land specifically set aside, solves the problem
</p> <p> 21:48:48 Talarus Luan: Well, it doesn't
</p> <p> 21:48:50 Lennox Larkham: sims a being ruin by a hand full
</p> <p> 21:48:52 Trinity Coulter: yes, it does
</p> <p> 21:49:01 Talarus Luan: If it is next to your land, then you have to still see the eyesores
</p> <p> 21:49:06 Jeffrey Gomez: It only solves the problem when combined with a ban on current actions.
</p> <p> 21:49:10 Trinity Coulter: so what
</p> <p> 21:49:12 Jeffrey Gomez: And letting the market adjust.
</p> <p> 21:49:18 Trinity Coulter: that solves the problem, Talarus, because the market adjusts land prices
</p> <p> 21:49:23 Talarus Luan: *shrug* that's the problem
</p> <p> 21:49:25 Jeffrey Gomez: It's a bit like owning land next to the old telehubs.
</p> <p> 21:49:36 Lennox Larkham: one person can put up thousand of crap
</p> <p> 21:49:39 Jeffrey Gomez: Which is fine, because that was a contained market.
</p> <p> 21:49:42 Trinity Coulter: if the land is next to the zoned ad space, you KNOW ahead of time
</p> <p> 21:49:47 Talarus Luan: Whose land are they going to appropriate to put up Linden-sanctioned adfarms?
</p> <p> 21:49:52 Esther Merryman: there is also the issue that all of sl is effectively sever space
</p> <p> 21:49:56 Talarus Luan: Yeah, but that ONLY works for new sims
</p> <p> 21:49:59 Jeffrey Gomez: Land they already have access to?
</p> <p> 21:50:01 Herne Diker: Well they did say the frontier is over and the pragmatists are here. Thats us. Use that line with Lindens
</p> <p> 21:50:08 Esther Merryman: we pay for our space
</p> <p> 21:50:10 Jeffrey Gomez: Route 1? Welcome areas? Sandboxes?
</p> <p> 21:50:13 Trinity Coulter: yes, but land has turnover
</p> <p> 21:50:15 Jeffrey Gomez: There's a lot to work with there.
</p> <p> 21:50:18 Talarus Luan: I don't want them to install such crap next to me
</p> <p> 21:50:23 Talarus Luan: Neither do any of my neighbors
</p> <p> 21:50:26 Trinity Coulter: eventually it could be on all sims, or only on every other sim, etc
</p> <p> 21:50:32 Esther Merryman: whatever is on another is imaterial as far as LL are concerned
</p> <p> 21:50:36 Herne Diker: I did see signs around the welcome are as a noob and I did pay attention
</p> <p> 21:50:40 Trinity Coulter: but it solves the problem
</p> <p> 21:50:41 Talarus Luan: Is LL going to buy us all out to put up a 512sqm adfarm?
</p> <p> 21:50:44 Jeffrey Gomez: That depends on which sims they're placed in.
</p> <p> 21:50:48 Talarus Luan: But, it /doesn't/
</p> <p> 21:50:54 Trinity Coulter: yes, it does
</p> <p> 21:50:56 Jeffrey Gomez: But it wasn't my choice to buy on the road. :p
</p> <p> 21:50:59 Trinity Coulter: :)
</p> <p> 21:51:00 Talarus Luan: Not for me. :)
</p> <p> 21:51:02 Lennox Larkham: each time they put up a add they should be charged 10000000 lindens
</p> <p> 21:51:06 Talarus Luan: Maybe for you.
</p> <p> 21:51:10 Trinity Coulter: for everyone it does
</p> <p> 21:51:14 Drongle McMahon: No ... let's just have 100 sims packed with adfarms and none anywhere else.
</p> <p> 21:51:18 Trinity Coulter: ads would get contained
</p> <p> 21:51:22 Talarus Luan: No, it doesn't. I am sorry, but you are quite wrong
</p> <p> 21:51:26 Trinity Coulter: and we would still have ad space
</p> <p> 21:51:28 Timo Daehlie: the ad sim lol
</p> <p> 21:51:30 Jeffrey Gomez: Realistically, they should put most of the ads in or around the old telehubs.
</p> <p> 21:51:34 Jeffrey Gomez: Which are still there, as far as I know.
</p> <p> 21:51:36 Herne Diker: Like a giant catalog sim
</p> <p> 21:51:41 Talarus Luan: Anyway.
</p> <p> 21:51:47 Askew Aeon: oh got an idea, how about sims like pg, mature, and add free
</p> <p> 21:51:50 Trinity Coulter: do you think there should be NO advertising?
</p> <p> 21:51:57 Drongle McMahon: exactly ... those who want to find info from them can.
</p> <p> 21:52:04 Jeffrey Gomez: That's unrealistic, Trinity.
</p> <p> 21:52:06 Askew Aeon: so you can choose where you go
</p> <p> 21:52:08 Talarus Luan: Feel free to make your suggestion to the Lindens, but I couldn't support it because it doesn't worj for me.
</p> <p> 21:52:14 Trinity Coulter: right it is unrealistic
</p> <p> 21:52:17 Herne Diker: search engines are the best way to advert
</p> <p> 21:52:20 Talarus Luan: No, I never said there should be no advertising
</p> <p> 21:52:23 Jeffrey Gomez: Nor is that the point.
</p> <p> 21:52:25 Drongle McMahon: The rest of us that pay for our space don't have to.
</p> <p> 21:52:30 Talarus Luan: I don't want it in my face
</p> <p> 21:52:34 Jeffrey Gomez: The point is the method of advertising, not the advertising itself.
</p> <p> 21:52:37 Trinity Coulter: so instead of all or nothing... why not a compromise with a certain area set aside
</p> <p> 21:52:48 Herne Diker: I don't want it so blatently in my face
</p> <p> 21:52:52 Talarus Luan: There is a space set aside.. in my mall, on my terms
</p> <p> 21:52:56 Trinity Coulter: ads anywhere else are an instant clear AR
</p> <p> 21:53:09 Talarus Luan: Outside of that, no advertising
</p> <p> 21:53:18 Talarus Luan: There are good ways to do it, and bad ways
</p> <p> 21:53:</p> <p> 21 Jeffrey Gomez: Good luck with that.
</p> <p> 21:53:23 Rem Nightfire: sounds a bit like the TAG line
</p> <p> 21:53:25 Drongle McMahon: Trinity ... other web services I use never compel paying customers to seed ads.
</p> <p> 21:53:29 Trinity Coulter: i'm only talking about the stuff that we might consider a billboard in RL
</p> <p> 21:53:35 Talarus Luan: This isn't RL
</p> <p> 21:53:38 Talarus Luan: This is SL
</p> <p> 21:53:44 Talarus Luan: There is no need to make SL=RL
</p> <p> 21:53:49 Herne Diker: Better probably, code rules on adverts
</p> <p> 21:53:51 Trinity Coulter: i don't understand Drongle's comment
</p> <p> 21:53:54 Askew Aeon: hopefully
</p> <p> 21:53:58 Jeffrey Gomez: The only way the issue will progress, is through compromise, unless there is a clear cut negative to one practice in lieu of another.
</p> <p> 21:54:05 Esther Merryman: yes i agree trinity
</p> <p> 21:54:</p> <p> 21 MaCelia Morane: I don't see billboards in my backyard in RL - why SL?
</p> <p> 21:54:28 Nostrum Forder: /me clears her throat
</p> <p> 21:54:32 Drongle McMahon: Why? Because all advertsing is unwelcome imposition, unless it is optional.
</p> <p> 21:54:36 Nostrum Forder: SL has this huge scale problem
</p> <p> 21:54:40 Nostrum Forder: nothing is scaled right
</p> <p> 21:54:42 Esther Merryman: small plots should be allowed to be used as seen fit with a size limit on billboards
</p> <p> 21:54:47 Trinity Coulter: it is optional, Drongle
</p> <p> 21:54:49 Jeffrey Gomez: Because in SL, we don't have comprehensive land planning.
</p> <p> 21:54:51 Jeffrey Gomez: It's just rubberstamp, set for sale, done.
</p> <p> 21:54:54 Trinity Coulter: buy the land that is set aside for ads
</p> <p> 21:54:56 Nostrum Forder: Adds are way off the chart inthis respect
</p> <p> 21:54:58 Drongle McMahon: No it isn't....
</p> <p> 21:55:04 Nostrum Forder: even RL billboards have limits
</p> <p> 21:55:06 Esther Merryman: LL will never zone the existing sims of mainland
</p> <p> 21:55:10 Trinity Coulter: those ad parcels would command high prices
</p> <p> 21:55:20 Nostrum Forder: physics keeps them from being enormous
</p> <p> 21:55:22 Trinity Coulter: and the land by them would be lower priced
</p> <p> 21:55:25 Jeffrey Gomez: The current argument is that you can do whatever it is you want with your land.
</p> <p> 21:55:31 Talarus Luan: ..and would be boarded over by the neighbors
</p> <p> 21:55:35 Rem Nightfire: ahh heres the catch
</p> <p> 21:55:37 Jeffrey Gomez: This is true. However, they're not using their land when they put up ads.
</p> <p> 21:55:43 Jeffrey Gomez: They're using ours.
</p> <p> 21:55:46 Trinity Coulter: yes, Jeffrey, and that leads to problems
</p> <p> 21:55:50 Esther Merryman: thats why we need LL limit sizes
</p> <p> 21:55:53 Nostrum Forder: but in SL, you can do all this sh*t and not pay the piper.
</p> <p> 21:56:00 Rem Nightfire: not for long
</p> <p> 21:56:02 Nostrum Forder: Sorry for my language, but it's how I talk.
</p> <p> 21:56:06 Herne Diker: Which linden is involved?
</p> <p> 21:56:08 Talarus Luan: In RL, you cannot just put up signs
</p> <p> 21:56:10 Timo Daehlie: wb lennos ;)
</p> <p> 21:56:11 Nostrum Forder: right
</p> <p> 21:56:13 Jeffrey Gomez: No. What we need is policy such that everyone that isn't a complete asshat wins.
</p> <p> 21:56:20 Lennox Larkham: yes
</p> <p> 21:56:</p> <p> 21 Nostrum Forder: but even if you CAN put them up legally
</p> <p> 21:56:24 Trinity Coulter: if you have a zoned area, the land market will adjust
</p> <p> 21:56:29 Nostrum Forder: there are physics involved
</p> <p> 21:56:34 Talarus Luan: Most places have sign ordinances, and you often have to get permits to put up billboards
</p> <p> 21:56:41 Nostrum Forder: make your sight narrow and tall
</p> <p> 21:56:44 Nostrum Forder: wind blows it over
</p> <p> 21:56:47 Nostrum Forder: not in SL
</p> <p> 21:56:49 Rem Nightfire: or short and fat
</p> <p> 21:56:52 Lennox Larkham: zone laws might work
</p> <p> 21:56:55 Jeffrey Gomez: Realistically speaking, we're looking at maybe one or two people to work on the thing, and maybe a few hours a day by a dozen part timers to police it, if that.
</p> <p> 21:57:08 Esther Merryman: LL will not zone the existing lands
</p> <p> 21:57:11 Talarus Luan: You can't get permits to put up billboards in most places, and citizen pressure can nullify permits.
</p> <p> 21:57:18 Esther Merryman: that is almost a given
</p> <p> 21:57:20 Trinity Coulter: also, i have several other proposals that relate to promotion/advertising that might help with this issue
</p> <p> 21:57:27 Jeffrey Gomez: The only land they could realistically zone is Linden land.
</p> <p> 21:57:33 Talarus Luan: However, none of that applies to SL
</p> <p> 21:57:36 Jeffrey Gomez: Welcome Area. Sandbox. Tele and Infohubs.
</p> <p> 21:57:39 Esther Merryman: imagine the uproar from existing owners
</p> <p> 21:57:43 Jeffrey Gomez: Route 1.
</p> <p> 21:57:44 Nostrum Forder: Yes Talarus
</p> <p> 21:57:46 Jeffrey Gomez: Busy Ben's Vehicle Lot.
</p> <p> 21:57:49 Esther Merryman: not adfarmers
</p> <p> 21:57:51 Jeffrey Gomez: Rizal Sports.
</p> <p> 21:57:53 Jeffrey Gomez: Etc.
</p> <p> 21:57:54 Talarus Luan: Well, tell ya what. Put them on a notecard, and pass them out. :)
</p> <p> 21:57:58 Nostrum Forder: but RL has recognizable governance that can enforce zoning
</p> <p> 21:58:02 Esther Merryman: but a guy thay owns 512sqm
</p> <p> 21:58:04 Trinity Coulter: well its just 2 things, Talarus
</p> <p> 21:58:06 Nostrum Forder: and LL doesn't want to be the governent
</p> <p> 21:58:09 Rem Nightfire: good idea lets move on
</p> <p> 21:58:12 Lennox Larkham: in real life you have to get a permit and it has to go through the board
</p> <p> 21:58:17 Nostrum Forder: (the governor, but not the government)
</p> <p> 21:58:20 Esther Merryman: with a huge tower on it
</p> <p> 21:58:23 Jeffrey Gomez: They don't?
</p> <p> 21:58:25 Talarus Luan: I am all for looking at proposals. If there is something I can get behind, I will. If not, I will pass for myself, of course.
</p> <p> 21:58:34 Jeffrey Gomez: Fooled me.
</p> <p> 21:58:36 Esther Merryman: stuff like that
</p> <p> 21:58:38 Nostrum Forder: Nopw
</p> <p> 21:58:40 Nostrum Forder: they don't
</p> <p> 21:58:43 Herne Diker: Government comes from organized residents not LL
</p> <p> 21:58:45 Nostrum Forder: it's why they push estate land so much
</p> <p> 21:58:48 Jeffrey Gomez: I think you mean they want all the power without the time investment on mundane issues.
</p> <p> 21:58:53 Lennox Larkham: there are size matters that come into play
</p> <p> 21:58:55 Talarus Luan: Well, LL are our benevolent dictators
</p> <p> 21:58:58 Nostrum Forder: they want out of content
</p> <p> 21:58:59 Jeffrey Gomez: Like keeping the peons happy.
</p> <p> 21:59:01 Trinity Coulter: my 1st of the 2 other proposals is a new framework for the Search tool in SL
</p> <p> 21:59:15 Lennox Larkham: and also what goes on a sign
</p> <p> 21:59:33 Herne Diker: Porn in the air is awful.
</p> <p> 21:59:35 Trinity Coulter: to add a script command and a customizable tab in Search that would be able to be pointed at a resident-created Search page
</p> <p> 21:59:42 Talarus Luan: Sounds like something that needs to be sent directly to LL via a JIRA feature request that we can all vote on.
</p> <p> 21:59:49 Rem Nightfire: could we get notecards for your proposals trinity rather than discussing them now?
</p> <p> 21:59:54 Trinity Coulter: well i just said it :)
</p> <p> 21:59:56 Trinity Coulter: that's the whole thing</p> <p> 22:00:01 Talarus Luan: Yup. Make a JIRA for it. :)</p> <p> 22:00:04 Herne Diker: good idea trinity</p> <p> 22:00:06 Trinity Coulter: i don't like the jira</p> <p> 22:00:22 Talarus Luan: /me shrugs. "Then LL will never notice or care"</p> <p> 22:00:26 Lennox Larkham: you donot go down your neignbor side walk and see pono up on a sign for all the worl to see</p> <p> 22:00:33 Lennox Larkham: world</p> <p> 22:00:55 Trinity Coulter: people in SL have no real gridwide network for news, information, promotion, or advertising</p> <p> 22:01:01 Esther Merryman: herne porn on adboards in pg sims is removed by LL</p> <p> 22:01:14 Esther Merryman: AR any if you see them</p> <p> 22:01:19 Herne Diker: mature doesn't mean porn to me</p> <p> 22:01:22 Talarus Luan: As long as it remains an opt-in, it sounds like a good idea.</p> <p> 22:01:26 Esther Merryman: i got one today:-)</p> <p> 22:01:41 Lennox Larkham: it should not be alowed in a m sim</p> <p> 22:01:50 Lennox Larkham: pono is pono</p> <p> 22:01:58 Esther Merryman: LL dont care though</p> <p> 22:02:06 Talarus Luan: Openpublic lewdness is also not allowed in M regions</p> <p> 22:02:24 Lennox Larkham: good m pon or pg good pono ?</p> <p> 22:02:27 Esther Merryman: we have to act in a way LL will listen and possibly take on our ideas</p> <p> 22:02:40 Herne Diker: AR floods?</p> <p> 22:02:52 Esther Merryman: they have rules so far they stick to</p> <p> 22:02:56 Talarus Luan: AR floods won't work</p> <p> 22:02:59 Jeffrey Gomez: Speaking of which, we need to get concierge on BTE.</p> <p> 22:03:04 MaCelia Morane: What does LL really listen to?</p> <p> 22:03:07 Lennox Larkham: peaceful ways work the best</p> <p> 22:03:09 Timo Daehlie: to $$</p> <p> 22:03:11 Jeffrey Gomez: Those porn and malware ads are amazingly naive.</p> <p> 22:03:16 Jeffrey Gomez: And need to be taken down. Now.</p> <p> 22:03:20 Esther Merryman: to many ars is not good either</p> <p> 22:03:23 Lennox Larkham: war gets us no were</p> <p> 22:03:26 Rem Nightfire: at this point the best thing is i think to wait and see what the policy change is</p> <p> 22:03:35 Rem Nightfire: we should know in about a week</p> <p> 22:03:38 Talarus Luan: They listen to residents who come to their office hours, who write them via email, open support tickets, call them on the phone, and/or write them paper letters.</p> <p> 22:03:52 Lennox Larkham: what policy</p> <p> 22:03:56 Esther Merryman: only ar clear breaks of TOS</p> <p> 22:03:59 Drongle McMahon: LL listens to lawyers</p> <p> 22:04:02 Talarus Luan: Well, War has gotten us to where we are today</p> <p> 22:04:06 Trinity Coulter: they listen best to residents who agree with what they want to do</p> <p> 22:04:11 Lennox Larkham: everyonr here has rights</p> <p> 22:04:13 Rem Nightfire: from LL what jack referred to in the last meeting</p> <p> 22:04:38 Lennox Larkham: iam new here i see thank for telling me</p> <p> 22:04:42 Jeffrey Gomez: I'd argue discussing the issues and keeping focused got us to where we are now.</p> <p> 22:04:50 Jeffrey Gomez: "War" is just a fun spin on that.</p> <p> 22:04:58 Lennox Larkham: war sucks</p> <p> 22:05:00 Jeffrey Gomez: And a great way to piss off TAG.</p> <p> 22:05:14 Talarus Luan: Listen, folks... our efforts have 1) gotten the attention of LL and have helped prompt them to act, and 2) have put severe pressure on the adfarmers and extortionists to the point where they are fighting for their very existence.</p> <p> 22:05:39 Herne Diker: someone did put some sort of mine on the ad farm around me</p> <p> 22:05:44 MaCelia Morane: What's TAG?</p> <p> 22:05:47 Jeffrey Gomez: Aww. I don't have a "WAR. What issss it good for?" gesture.</p> <p> 22:05:52 Esther Merryman: here is a great way</p> <p> 22:05:54 Timo Daehlie: you dont want to know macelia ;)</p> <p> 22:05:57 Jeffrey Gomez: The Advertisers Guild. It's basically a thin attempt at "legitimizing" their practice.</p> <p> 22:06:04 Rem Nightfire: The Advertisers Guld</p> <p> 22:06:06 Herne Diker: thats a group</p> <p> 22:06:08 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:06:10 Jeffrey Gomez: By the most vocal of ad farmers, really.</p> <p> 22:06:14 MaCelia Morane: Ah, thanks for the info</p> <p> 22:06:16 Nostrum Forder: War is a metaphor</p> <p> 22:06:19 Lennox Larkham: being pissed off will not get either side out of this mess</p> <p> 22:06:23 Nostrum Forder: if it works, that's great</p> <p> 22:06:26 Talarus Luan: yes, it is a metaphor</p> <p> 22:06:29 Nostrum Forder: if it doesn't find your own</p> <p> 22:06:32 Timo Daehlie: yes ;)</p> <p> 22:06:35 Nostrum Forder: the objective is the same</p> <p> 22:06:39 Timo Daehlie: we dont go out with weapons ;)</p> <p> 22:06:42 Talarus Luan: being pissed off is why I am here</p> <p> 22:06:45 Nostrum Forder: my metaphor is "reforestation"</p> <p> 22:06:48 Nostrum Forder: It works for me</p> <p> 22:06:51 Timo Daehlie: but we ve tried all other things so "war" is the last option ;)</p> <p> 22:06:57 Nostrum Forder: I can speak in terms of the war metaphor, but I don't think that way.</p> <p> 22:07:12 Nostrum Forder: Except Wispy.</p> <p> 22:07:14 Talarus Luan: I've been abused enough by these morons. I won't stop until they are gone, or I am banned.</p> <p> 22:07:</p> <p> 21 Esther Merryman: war is not the answer</p> <p> 22:07:24 Nostrum Forder: Him, I'm gonna kill, and feed him to my kitty.</p> <p> 22:07:28 Lennox Larkham: planting tree is always a good thing to do</p> <p> 22:07:33 Nostrum Forder: /me grins.</p> <p> 22:07:36 Esther Merryman: but active campaigning is</p> <p> 22:07:40 Talarus Luan: ..and by "they" I mean them in combination with their activities.</p> <p> 22:07:46 [Sealpoint Kitten]: mews.</p> <p> 22:07:49 Herne Diker: trees arnt 30 m high</p> <p> 22:07:51 Esther Merryman: that is what we are trying to acheive</p> <p> 22:07:55 Lennox Larkham: plant the trees next to the signs</p> <p> 22:07:58 Winter Wardhani: (guys sorry got to go.. will try to get back still)</p> <p> 22:08:02 Talarus Luan: If they stop, then I am happy.</p> <p> 22:08:05 Timo Daehlie: thx for coming winter ;)</p> <p> 22:08:08 Rem Nightfire: call it what you wish we are all working for the same goal</p> <p> 22:08:13 Esther Merryman: mobilizing the masses</p> <p> 22:08:15 Nostrum Forder: Herne - trees can be big</p> <p> 22:08:18 Esther Merryman: to acheive our goals</p> <p> 22:08:</p> <p> 21 Jeffrey Gomez: Yep.</p> <p> 22:08:23 Timo Daehlie: call it movement ;)</p> <p> 22:08:26 Nostrum Forder: Heart Centre has giant megaprim trees</p> <p> 22:08:31 Talarus Luan: War is just a word, folks.</p> <p> 22:08:35 Jeffrey Gomez: Especially those pine ones.</p> <p> 22:08:38 Lennox Larkham: yes they can</p> <p> 22:08:40 Jeffrey Gomez: Yus.</p> <p> 22:08:42 Nostrum Forder: they are expensive, but beautiful</p> <p> 22:08:46 Nostrum Forder: and they cover nicely.</p> <p> 22:08:50 Talarus Luan: It means that we are mobilizing to achieve a goal, pretty much no matter the cost.</p> <p> 22:08:57 Lennox Larkham: these are real people out there on there pc's</p> <p> 22:09:01 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:09:03 Nostrum Forder: (not a plug, I get no commission)</p> <p> 22:09:07 Talarus Luan: For me, it is time, effort, and some money</p> <p> 22:09:11 Esther Merryman: night winter</p> <p> 22:09:14 Herne Diker: lots of money</p> <p> 22:09:16 Talarus Luan: So are we, Lennox</p> <p> 22:09:20 Lennox Larkham: yes</p> <p> 22:09:25 Rem Nightfire: its worth it</p> <p> 22:09:28 Lennox Larkham: your right</p> <p> 22:09:32 Talarus Luan: Yet, we are being harassed and extorted</p> <p> 22:09:44 Timo Daehlie: austin is too lol ;)</p> <p> 22:10:02 Talarus Luan: So, regardless of who or where they are, they need to be held accountable for their actions.</p> <p> 22:10:22 MaCelia Morane: But focus on their actions, not them personally</p> <p> 22:10:50 Talarus Luan: Our War effort does this by informing the publlic of their shenanigans and getting people to stop buying their extortionist plots.</p> <p> 22:10:57 Esther Merryman: yes but it is hard</p> <p> 22:10:59 Lennox Larkham: we have to tell all our friends not to buy from them and they should be accountable for what they are doing</p> <p> 22:11:06 Jeffrey Gomez: The question of them personally is a very different one than the issues. :p</p> <p> 22:11:11 Talarus Luan: Their actions are who they are.</p> <p> 22:11:14 Timo Daehlie: passing on the word indeed</p> <p> 22:11:16 Rem Nightfire: will robin be back this week timo?</p> <p> 22:11:19 Esther Merryman: when they attack you personally</p> <p> 22:11:</p> <p> 21 Jeffrey Gomez: I think one more week.</p> <p> 22:11:23 Timo Daehlie: dunno i think she has 2 weeks holiday for what i ve heard</p> <p> 22:11:27 Timo Daehlie: yes jeff</p> <p> 22:11:29 Talarus Luan: I don't know who they are in RL; I don't care.</p> <p> 22:11:33 Lennox Larkham: click on there land and you will get there profile</p> <p> 22:11:40 Jeffrey Gomez: Well. Other than Ancient and his group. :p</p> <p> 22:11:43 Rem Nightfire: ok</p> <p> 22:11:45 Talarus Luan: Who they are here are parasites and leeches.</p> <p> 22:11:48 Herne Diker: can we help new people find plots that are sold by good people. As a noob I had no idea.</p> <p> 22:12:03 Rem Nightfire: there are some of those here now</p> <p> 22:12:13 Lennox Larkham: and send in the reports ot linden every day</p> <p> 22:12:16 Esther Merryman: that is what i am trying to set up</p> <p> 22:12:23 Timo Daehlie: thats our goal too herne .. that llc will give some more information to new residents as well</p> <p> 22:12:28 Esther Merryman: not advising people who to buy from</p> <p> 22:12:40 Esther Merryman: but how to look for good land</p> <p> 22:12:47 Esther Merryman: signs as it were</p> <p> 22:12:50 MaCelia Morane: good idea</p> <p> 22:13:03 Lennox Larkham: its seems ot me you have been trying very hard at this</p> <p> 22:13:14 Lennox Larkham: and for some time</p> <p> 22:13:22 Esther Merryman: small plots nearby expect to be harassed dont buy</p> <p> 22:13:27 Timo Daehlie: long long time ;)</p> <p> 22:13:30 Esther Merryman: speak to the neigbours</p> <p> 22:13:37 Esther Merryman: see how they act</p> <p> 22:13:42 Herne Diker: can we get a class going on the traing islands to tell incoming new people of the issue</p> <p> 22:13:47 Talarus Luan: Also, we are building on an idea one of our members had which lists good advertising networks.</p> <p> 22:13:58 Esther Merryman: think of the investment you are making</p> <p> 22:14:06 Jeffrey Gomez: Well, I want to get stuff up at YadNi's.</p> <p> 22:14:14 Talarus Luan: If you all know of any, or discover any which do not use outdoor advertising, adfarming, or extortion, please pass them on</p> <p> 22:14:33 Esther Merryman: before you leap into a purchase</p> <p> 22:14:38 Jeffrey Gomez: I still need something *to* give him though.</p> <p> 22:14:42 Rem Nightfire: are the fountains and signs there jeffry?</p> <p> 22:14:46 Talarus Luan: Lennox-> some here have been working for years on this problem</p> <p> 22:14:51 Lennox Larkham: we all are not dumb and i think like you have been talking it will take some time with this problem</p> <p> 22:15:06 Jeffrey Gomez: Rem: I need something that has transfer and copy perms.</p> <p> 22:15:10 Talarus Luan: It has and it will</p> <p> 22:15:15 Timo Daehlie: we know pretty well about all of them lennox .. in detail ;)</p> <p> 22:15:19 Jeffrey Gomez: And that is geared more to newbies.</p> <p> 22:15:22 Talarus Luan: There is no expectation that it will be resolved overnight</p> <p> 22:15:27 Rem Nightfire: they are</p> <p> 22:15:29 Rem Nightfire: ok</p> <p> 22:15:35 Timo Daehlie: hwo they work .. who they are .. them alts .. them methds ..</p> <p> 22:15:40 Lennox Larkham: only 10 months for me</p> <p> 22:15:43 Jeffrey Gomez: I wanted to put out the Ad Zoo box, but its perms were messed up a bit.</p> <p> 22:15:53 Timo Daehlie: sorry jeff ;)</p> <p> 22:15:55 Lennox Larkham: i have spent alot of $</p> <p> 22:16:00 Jeffrey Gomez: And there's an item with PERMISSION_DEBIT that I don't want to put into newbie hands just yet.</p> <p> 22:16:06 Lennox Larkham: but no more</p> <p> 22:16:17 Timo Daehlie: had a little prob with a rl surgeon in rl but i ll pass it on to you asap</p> <p> 22:16:28 Talarus Luan: You shouldn't put the tip jar as a newbie item, Jeff.</p> <p> 22:16:34 Jeffrey Gomez: Exactly so.</p> <p> 22:16:39 Lennox Larkham: tips are good</p> <p> 22:16:41 Talarus Luan: Just remove it</p> <p> 22:16:48 Jeffrey Gomez: That doesn't fix the perms problem.</p> <p> 22:17:03 Talarus Luan: What else requires debit perms?</p> <p> 22:17:12 Jeffrey Gomez: No. The copy/trans perms.</p> <p> 22:17:24 Esther Merryman: i will make a sign with my land buying tips on</p> <p> 22:17:43 Jeffrey Gomez: What I'm looking for is a box to give to newbies of the junkyard specifically.</p> <p> 22:17:56 Lennox Larkham: the zone law keeps on my mind</p> <p> 22:17:58 Jeffrey Gomez: Something very simple like the Ad Zoo box, copy/trans so YadNi can put it out.</p> <p> 22:18:05 Jeffrey Gomez: That's really it.</p> <p> 22:18:07 Timo Daehlie: i have a box here jeff .. but maybe not all objects are full perm</p> <p> 22:18:12 Jeffrey Gomez: /me nods</p> <p> 22:18:20 Rem Nightfire: what do you see in there jeffrey? is the folder from the fountain ok?</p> <p> 22:18:24 Jeffrey Gomez: When it becomes convenient would be great.</p> <p> 22:18:28 Timo Daehlie: i ve a look at it later on and have to check if all thats in it is up to date</p> <p> 22:18:34 Talarus Luan: As long as they are copy, they should be fine</p> <p> 22:18:46 Jeffrey Gomez: Rem: I'd prefer it if I'm given it specifically, so we get as much as we want in there.</p> <p> 22:19:03 Jeffrey Gomez: Preferably, geared to YadNi's base of newbies.</p> <p> 22:19:24 Jeffrey Gomez: Once I have something I can run with like that, I'll pass it to him and he'll set it out.</p> <p> 22:19:41 Rem Nightfire: ok</p> <p> 22:19:51 Esther Merryman: what about the other free sites</p> <p> 22:20:11 Esther Merryman: freebie dungeon</p> <p> 22:20:20 Esther Merryman: other places do we have any other contacts</p> <p> 22:20:29 Talarus Luan: Those would be, too, as well as NCI</p> <p> 22:20:32 Esther Merryman: gnubie</p> <p> 22:20:42 Nostrum Forder: I need to bail. A DJ didn't show for a gig, I need to back-fill.</p> <p> 22:20:55 Nostrum Forder: Great work, everryone, and sorry I haven't made these before this.</p> <p> 22:20:59 Esther Merryman: there are lots of them</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:02 Nostrum Forder: Hope to see you all next week.</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:05 Talarus Luan: Jeffrey knows YadNi for a long time, which is why he suggested it. It wasn't meant to be exclusive. ;)</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:11 Esther Merryman: bye nostrum</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:14 Timo Daehlie: thx nostrum ;)</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:20 Talarus Luan: Take care and thanks for coming, Nostrum.</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:23 Esther Merryman: take care</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:24 Herne Diker: ciou</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:26 Jeffrey Gomez: Correct ^</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:27 Rem Nightfire: bye nostrum</p> <p> 22:</p> <p> 21:51 Lennox Larkham: peace always folks thank you for all the info</p> <p> 22:22:06 Talarus Luan: Take care, Lennox</p> <p> 22:22:11 Rem Nightfire: bye thanks for your ideas lennox</p> <p> 22:22:16 Esther Merryman: take care lennox</p> <p> 22:22:22 Jeffrey Gomez: o/</p> <p> 22:22:26 Lennox Larkham: ok keep pluging away</p> <p> 22:22:33 Talarus Luan: We will. :)</p> <p> 22:22:38 Lennox Larkham: ill come back</p> <p> 22:22:51 Talarus Luan: As long as there is a cause, we'll be there fighting for it. ;)</p> <p> 22:23:02 Lennox Larkham: in the mean time plant a tree lol</p> <p> 22:23:10 Herne Diker: How do we all make sure we hear of the next meeting before its going to happen?</p> <p> 22:23:14 Rem Nightfire: yes!</p> <p> 22:23:25 Talarus Luan: Meeting is every Sunday at 2PM SLT</p> <p> 22:23:27 Lennox Larkham: yes</p> <p> 22:23:31 Herne Diker: thanks</p> <p> 22:23:32 Rem Nightfire: which meeting herne?</p> <p> 22:23:40 Herne Diker: this one</p> <p> 22:23:44 Lennox Larkham: always at 2 on Sun</p> <p> 22:23:49 Lennox Larkham: ?</p> <p> 22:23:50 Rem Nightfire: did you get my notice?</p> <p> 22:23:55 Herne Diker: yes</p> <p> 22:23:57 Esther Merryman: yes</p> <p> 22:24:03 Lennox Larkham: yes</p> <p> 22:24:04 Talarus Luan: We usually send out notices/reminders as well. :)</p> <p> 22:24:09 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:24:20 Talarus Luan: On the Ad Zoo group, and others here send out notices on the groups they manage.</p> <p> 22:25:08 Talarus Luan: One of the reasons I want a responsible advertiser list is because we have people asking us all the time "well, if not the billboard people, then who?"</p> <p> 22:25:44 Jeffrey Gomez: What the presence of "ad networks" tells us, is that there is a market for selling advertising, if not using it.</p> <p> 22:25:57 Rem Nightfire: i would like to suggest shimada be on that list he converted all his towers to short monuments</p> <p> 22:26:03 Jeffrey Gomez: Spam economics, in a way. But in some cases not.</p> <p> 22:26:09 Talarus Luan: yes, and there are responsible networks out there</p> <p> 22:26:15 Jeffrey Gomez: Yep.</p> <p> 22:26:16 Herne Diker: that might moderate the ad farm behaivior, if the good advertisers got more dollars for people being directed to them</p> <p> 22:26:34 Talarus Luan: Yep. That's one of the prongs of our attack.</p> <p> 22:26:45 Talarus Luan: Business model paradigm support. :)</p> <p> 22:27:00 Esther Merryman: advertising tends to be the front for the extortion racket though</p> <p> 22:27:08 Talarus Luan: Give the good guys business and starve out the bad ones. :)</p> <p> 22:27:</p> <p> 21 Talarus Luan: Aye, very true</p> <p> 22:27:25 Esther Merryman: even small for sale signs</p> <p> 22:27:47 Esther Merryman: are used to iritate</p> <p> 22:28:10 Herne Diker: anyone in the mentor program to spread politics with training</p> <p> 22:28:14 Esther Merryman: with high prices asked for the land they sit on</p> <p> 22:28:31 Talarus Luan: Several of the folks here are in the SL Mentors.</p> <p> 22:28:38 Herne Diker: good</p> <p> 22:28:40 Jeffrey Gomez: For Sale signs should fall under fair use, unless they're extortionary.</p> <p> 22:28:46 Rem Nightfire: anything over 10 L/m should be considered extortion</p> <p> 22:28:51 Herne Diker: yes</p> <p> 22:29:05 Jeffrey Gomez: I'd push that number up slightly for things like Bay City.</p> <p> 22:29:12 Timo Daehlie: yes .. buy me or you got an ad tomorrow here</p> <p> 22:29:14 Talarus Luan: Well, small plots at that price, anyway</p> <p> 22:29:17 Jeffrey Gomez: And the possibility of highly competitive zoned land.</p> <p> 22:29:20 Esther Merryman: i would say 4 to 5 times base rate</p> <p> 22:29:22 Rem Nightfire: ok, but just slightly</p> <p> 22:29:24 Jeffrey Gomez: Otherwise, yes.</p> <p> 22:29:32 Rem Nightfire: thats too high esther</p> <p> 22:29:35 Talarus Luan: Remember that large plots (512+) with high prices aren't really part of this issue</p> <p> 22:29:40 Timo Daehlie: ad boards with fireworks have to dissapear</p> <p> 22:29:43 Jeffrey Gomez: But that will not fly, as LL stated specifically they will not mess with the market.</p> <p> 22:29:48 Timo Daehlie: like dr mainland uses</p> <p> 22:29:50 Esther Merryman: 10 l is the level i pay for larger plots still</p> <p> 22:29:53 Jeffrey Gomez: Because if they do, land sales will just move to gray markets.</p> <p> 22:29:56 Jeffrey Gomez: And back channels.</p> <p> 22:30:03 Jeffrey Gomez: (The latter is my emphasis, not theirs)</p> <p> 22:30:12 Rem Nightfire: you must not be looking at the land search then</p> <p> 22:30:15 Talarus Luan: I don't pay any more that L$10/sqm for any microplots</p> <p> 22:30:24 Talarus Luan: But that's just me in my region</p> <p> 22:30:26 Timo Daehlie: you can buy my land for 9 esther ;)</p> <p> 22:30:31 Esther Merryman: i dont buy anywhere but the sim i am in</p> <p> 22:30:36 Talarus Luan: I wait long enough, they will eventually give up</p> <p> 22:30:39 Timo Daehlie: ow</p> <p> 22:30:43 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:30:49 Esther Merryman: thats why its 10 l</p> <p> 22:30:51 Jeffrey Gomez: Rem: There has been a suggestion to delist plots under a given size in land search.</p> <p> 22:31:11 Jeffrey Gomez: I think that's fair in theory, as it cuts out the bottom of the barrel marketing.</p> <p> 22:31:16 Jeffrey Gomez: But that's all it does.</p> <p> 22:31:19 Herne Diker: thats a good idea, tell the Lindens micro ploit clog the search</p> <p> 22:31:23 Rem Nightfire: yes i was reffering the cheap 512's to esther</p> <p> 22:31:29 Jeffrey Gomez: Ah.</p> <p> 22:31:39 Jeffrey Gomez: I miss the haydays of first land.</p> <p> 22:31:48 Timo Daehlie: dont mention jeff</p> <p> 22:31:51 Esther Merryman: yes i know rem</p> <p> 22:31:52 Jeffrey Gomez: :D</p> <p> 22:31:54 Timo Daehlie: lost my first land to a bot</p> <p> 22:31:56 Timo Daehlie: ;)</p> <p> 22:32:02 Jeffrey Gomez: Not surprised.</p> <p> 22:32:08 Rem Nightfire: wild west</p> <p> 22:32:11 Esther Merryman: thing is to people who dont deal in land</p> <p> 22:32:14 Timo Daehlie: toggled two weeks in land list till some was released</p> <p> 22:32:</p> <p> 21 Timo Daehlie: L$ 512 lol .. i missed that days</p> <p> 22:32:32 Esther Merryman: the going rate is the rate where they have settled</p> <p> 22:33:19 Talarus Luan: Alright. I believe Hekate is planning the build event for the first week in August</p> <p> 22:33:24 Esther Merryman: which tends to stay static</p> <p> 22:33:28 Rem Nightfire: greay</p> <p> 22:33:33 Rem Nightfire: *t</p> <p> 22:33:43 Talarus Luan: So, as soon as she sets the date, we'll need to get the word out.</p> <p> 22:33:46 Esther Merryman: land around me is up for sale at 20 l per sqm</p> <p> 22:33:48 Timo Daehlie: ok i ve to chech the date with her .. august will be pretty busy for me in rl</p> <p> 22:33:56 Esther Merryman: for 2856</p> <p> 22:34:07 Rem Nightfire: no one will buy it</p> <p> 22:34:12 Esther Merryman: it has been for the last 12months</p> <p> 22:34:19 Esther Merryman: yes</p> <p> 22:34:25 Esther Merryman: not even me</p> <p> 22:34:28 Esther Merryman: lol</p> <p> 22:34:51 Talarus Luan: On a lighter note, TAG is sponsoring a "build a better adtower" contest, which has L$25,000 in prize money. I don't recommend anyone bother, but I have put together two entries for my own amusement. :)</p> <p> 22:35:02 Esther Merryman: richard palance</p> <p> 22:35:05 Esther Merryman: thats the group owners name</p> <p> 22:35:08 Timo Daehlie: with tnt ?</p> <p> 22:35:12 Rem Nightfire: haha cant wait to see them talarus</p> <p> 22:35:24 Jeffrey Gomez: Most likely it'll go to one of their own.</p> <p> 22:35:41 Talarus Luan: They are right here, Rem</p> <p> 22:35:48 Talarus Luan: One in front of me, and one right behind me</p> <p> 22:35:57 Timo Daehlie: well if you calculate back the amount into rl us $ i think its a pretty insulting contest</p> <p> 22:36:02 Talarus Luan: On the table :D</p> <p> 22:36:09 Timo Daehlie: real advertisers would have offered a rl car</p> <p> 22:36:18 Timo Daehlie: not 10 dollar</p> <p> 22:36:</p> <p> 21 Esther Merryman: well at least they are doing something</p> <p> 22:36:24 Rem Nightfire: nice</p> <p> 22:36:33 Timo Daehlie: to get better of it eshter</p> <p> 22:36:39 Timo Daehlie: they are keeping up appearances</p> <p> 22:36:41 Jeffrey Gomez: You act as if they're legitimate advertisers.</p> <p> 22:36:59 Talarus Luan: My first entry is a 3-prim linkset, using <0.01,0.01,0.01>m prims with alpha constantly being set to 0 on all three every second. :D</p> <p> 22:37:07 Timo Daehlie: lol</p> <p> 22:37:09 Esther Merryman: their towers are currently about as basic as they come</p> <p> 22:37:26 Rem Nightfire: and they are still obnoxious</p> <p> 22:37:28 Timo Daehlie: you think that is coincedence</p> <p> 22:37:36 Timo Daehlie: some of them are into the game for some years</p> <p> 22:37:41 Talarus Luan: You can feel free to discover the second entry behind me.. it is click-to-sit</p> <p> 22:37:45 Timo Daehlie: they can build better</p> <p> 22:37:47 Esther Merryman: if they start to use one that is less of an eyesaw</p> <p> 22:38:02 Esther Merryman: then thats a step</p> <p> 22:38:18 Esther Merryman: bought on no doubt by this groups efforts</p> <p> 22:38:20 Herne Diker: one group builds little stone oblisks with small aqds on their sides. They are resonably discrete</p> <p> 22:38:37 Talarus Luan: Yes, but the issue that they don't get, Esther, is that it is the *advertising* itself that is the eyesore</p> <p> 22:38:42 Rem Nightfire: how high herne?</p> <p> 22:38:44 Jeffrey Gomez: It's not a question of eyesore. It's a question of method.</p> <p> 22:38:53 Herne Diker: 15 m I think</p> <p> 22:38:57 Timo Daehlie: lol</p> <p> 22:39:11 Rem Nightfire: yea maybe gnu's</p> <p> 22:39:16 Talarus Luan: It doesn't matter if it is encased in the prettiest build ever.. it is still large billboard outdoor advertising</p> <p> 22:39:31 Rem Nightfire: 15 m is too high in my opinion</p> <p> 22:39:44 Herne Diker: each ad is only a mor two sq</p> <p> 22:39:47 Esther Merryman: i think 5m is adequate</p> <p> 22:40:03 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:40:07 Esther Merryman: to allow easy reading</p> <p> 22:40:18 Rem Nightfire: or 4</p> <p> 22:40:19 Jeffrey Gomez: 5m is still self-defeating.</p> <p> 22:40:</p> <p> 21 Talarus Luan: If they make it smaller, it just makes it easier for us to cover up. :D</p> <p> 22:40:25 Esther Merryman: 15m is still excessive</p> <p> 22:40:26 Jeffrey Gomez: Because that isn't their motive.</p> <p> 22:40:42 Jeffrey Gomez: The more effective solution is to give them what they want, but on terms that are agreeable.</p> <p> 22:40:47 Rem Nightfire: yes jeffrey that is true</p> <p> 22:40:49 Esther Merryman: yes my sign is 4mx4m</p> <p> 22:40:54 Jeffrey Gomez: And what they want, sans extortion and griefing.</p> <p> 22:40:57 Esther Merryman: with a pole</p> <p> 22:41:07 Talarus Luan: Yeah, but that is what they want</p> <p> 22:41:16 Jeffrey Gomez: That is what most of them want.</p> <p> 22:41:19 San Penucca: hi</p> <p> 22:41:24 Esther Merryman: so probably a bit higher than my own estimate of 5m</p> <p> 22:41:28 Jeffrey Gomez: That is not what "legitimate advertisers" want.</p> <p> 22:41:31 Talarus Luan: Greetings, San</p> <p> 22:41:38 Jeffrey Gomez: Speaking for actual legitimacy instead of what TAG floats.</p> <p> 22:41:45 Esther Merryman: probably should shorten the pole to 1m</p> <p> 22:41:52 Timo Daehlie: bye san ;)</p> <p> 22:42:03 Talarus Luan: Someone you know, Timo? ;)</p> <p> 22:42:14 Timo Daehlie: i dont think so since it was born today ;)</p> <p> 22:42:46 Talarus Luan: Yeah, well.. someone could be trolling the events listings looking for something to do. ;)</p> <p> 22:42:51 Talarus Luan: Maybe. :P</p> <p> 22:43:14 Talarus Luan: I mean, I find this whole thing interesting and exciting, don't you all? :D</p> <p> 22:43:24 Herne Diker: yes</p> <p> 22:43:26 Rem Nightfire: yes!</p> <p> 22:43:37 Rem Nightfire: best fun ive had in a long time</p> <p> 22:43:51 Jeffrey Gomez: An actual event on the Event calendar?</p> <p> 22:43:54 Rem Nightfire: sl wise</p> <p> 22:43:55 Jeffrey Gomez: Blasphemy!</p> <p> 22:44:01 Rem Nightfire: i do have a rl too i think</p> <p> 22:44:07 Esther Merryman: i enjoy it when i get a bit of a response</p> <p> 22:44:12 Esther Merryman: lol</p> <p> 22:44:13 Talarus Luan: Alrighty. coming up on our two hour limit. Are there any questions or comments?</p> <p> 22:44:37 Talarus Luan: yes, I even had Austin spit at my feet at Robin Linden's office hour. :)</p> <p> 22:44:47 Esther Merryman: i mean out there in the rest of sl</p> <p> 22:44:53 Herne Diker: where do you get that anima</p> <p> 22:45:00 Timo Daehlie: well i was thinking about introducing a question hour for people who dont know much yet about ad farms</p> <p> 22:45:04 Rem Nightfire: that was a great show there can we get him to do it again?</p> <p> 22:45:13 Timo Daehlie: besides this regular meeting</p> <p> 22:45:26 Talarus Luan: I'll do my best, Rem. ;D</p> <p> 22:45:35 Herne Diker: noob parties with indoctrination</p> <p> 22:45:41 Esther Merryman: lol</p> <p> 22:45:44 Talarus Luan: hehe</p> <p> 22:45:45 Timo Daehlie: heheheeh ;)</p> <p> 22:45:47 Jeffrey Gomez: Austin is highly entertaining.</p> <p> 22:45:54 Talarus Luan: Yes, an orientation meeting would be good.</p> <p> 22:45:57 Rem Nightfire: we should have a party</p> <p> 22:45:58 Jeffrey Gomez: It's a shame he didn't show for Prok's appearance.</p> <p> 22:46:00 Esther Merryman: Austin and his priklands</p> <p> 22:46:02 Timo Daehlie: well i can dj ;)</p> <p> 22:46:06 Esther Merryman: hee he</p> <p> 22:46:12 Rem Nightfire: cool</p> <p> 22:46:55 Esther Merryman: instead of an hour to answer questions</p> <p> 22:47:06 Jeffrey Gomez: So a Meet and Greet, then.</p> <p> 22:47:07 Esther Merryman: why not put up signs educating</p> <p> 22:47:12 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:47:18 Herne Diker: 90 m high signs</p> <p> 22:47:24 Jeffrey Gomez: In part, because warm bodies are more fun.</p> <p> 22:47:27 Esther Merryman: giving the answers of what we are about</p> <p> 22:47:29 Rem Nightfire: ahhhhhh!</p> <p> 22:47:30 Timo Daehlie: cause each meeting we have to start with answering many question esther</p> <p> 22:47:55 Timo Daehlie: mostly the same as the weeks before</p> <p> 22:47:58 Herne Diker: can we get a free blog page, as a noob I have read a million of those</p> <p> 22:48:02 Jeffrey Gomez: Timo: lol, how i mine 4 fish???</p> <p> 22:48:20 Esther Merryman: yes but does it take an hour</p> <p> 22:48:26 Jeffrey Gomez: I like to think we're more educated than that, though. :D</p> <p> 22:48:29 Esther Merryman: and do people stay for the whole two hours now</p> <p> 22:48:31 Timo Daehlie: well question hour sounds good ;)</p> <p> 22:48:42 Rem Nightfire: we can explain as we mingle</p> <p> 22:48:43 Talarus Luan: Yes, I don't have a problem with that.</p> <p> 22:48:47 Esther Merryman: we still need them to be motivated to help</p> <p> 22:48:53 Timo Daehlie: we do esther</p> <p> 22:48:55 Herne Diker: voice chat? enabbled</p> <p> 22:49:00 Jeffrey Gomez: I wouldn't mind a "meet an ad farme^H^H^H^H^H^H advertiser" session.</p> <p> 22:49:03 Talarus Luan: Would be great to make it into a workshop chat</p> <p> 22:49:06 Jeffrey Gomez: Preferably with Austin.</p> <p> 22:49:11 Jeffrey Gomez: That'd nicely summarize what we were after. :p</p> <p> 22:49:13 Herne Diker: they are usually open to public</p> <p> 22:49:17 Esther Merryman: that would be so cool</p> <p> 22:49:27 Jeffrey Gomez: Bonus for a dunk tank.</p> <p> 22:49:37 Rem Nightfire: ahahahaah yes!</p> <p> 22:49:45 Esther Merryman: i like the sound of exact revenge on an adfarmer</p> <p> 22:49:48 Esther Merryman: lol</p> <p> 22:50:05 Jeffrey Gomez: Well, they'd have to be sporting people for the dunk tank idea. I don't think most of them are.</p> <p> 22:50:17 Rem Nightfire: chrischun?</p> <p> 22:50:18 Esther Merryman: i could sharpen my nails for the ocassion</p> <p> 22:50:</p> <p> 21 Jeffrey Gomez: Hell, I'd vote my avatar in the other tank if they want to dunk our party.</p> <p> 22:50:42 Jeffrey Gomez: There are lots of people that would line up to dunk me. :p</p> <p> 22:50:59 Talarus Luan: Well, you know... General GnuSense would probably come and do it.</p> <p> 22:51:02 Rem Nightfire: whats the venue?</p> <p> 22:51:07 Rem Nightfire: he might</p> <p> 22:51:22 Talarus Luan: He actually has a very good sense of humor about all of this, even though he is adamant about his business.</p> <p> 22:51:31 Rem Nightfire: yes</p> <p> 22:51:35 Jeffrey Gomez: Yep.</p> <p> 22:52:07 Rem Nightfire: hes okay at times</p> <p> 22:52:20 Esther Merryman: well that makes it more fun</p> <p> 22:52:23 Jeffrey Gomez: He's the only one that seems capable of not acting like a raving loon in public.</p> <p> 22:52:43 Esther Merryman: it becomes such a serious subject sometimes</p> <p> 22:52:47 Timo Daehlie: 10.000 for putting up an ad sign lol</p> <p> 22:52:58 Talarus Luan: I get the impression if they banned his business tomorrow, he'd just find a different way to do it.</p> <p> 22:53:15 Timo Daehlie: they will step into microplots</p> <p> 22:53:25 Talarus Luan: While Chrischun and Ancient would scream and piss and moan with earsplitting howling.</p> <p> 22:53:28 Esther Merryman: thats probably because he would</p> <p> 22:53:42 Rem Nightfire: not if LL steps up to the plate like they should</p> <p> 22:53:57 Jeffrey Gomez: I dunno. I think I seriously pissed Ancient off with the "wasting his time" comment.</p> <p> 22:54:18 Rem Nightfire: he gets pissed if he gets a fart sideways</p> <p> 22:54:20 Talarus Luan: Oh, and I have now seen one of his adtowers.</p> <p> 22:54:27 Jeffrey Gomez: How was it?</p> <p> 22:54:31 Talarus Luan: Just outside to the west</p> <p> 22:54:51 Talarus Luan: 5 stacked cubes with the AdSoft ad on the bottom</p> <p> 22:55:31 Esther Merryman: whos is that</p> <p> 22:55:39 Talarus Luan: Err to the South, rather</p> <p> 22:55:53 Talarus Luan: Ancient Shriners</p> <p> 22:56:04 Esther Merryman: why do they use such rubbish designs</p> <p> 22:56:12 Esther Merryman: 5 cubes</p> <p> 22:56:13 Jeffrey Gomez: All that did was crash my client :<</p> <p> 22:56:19 Talarus Luan: because they are tech geeks, not market people</p> <p> 22:56:29 Timo Daehlie: i can block him there ;)</p> <p> 22:56:30 Jeffrey Gomez: They run a little ASP.NET shop.</p> <p> 22:56:32 Talarus Luan: They have no real experience in marketing</p> <p> 22:56:41 Esther Merryman: one is enough they can just cycle the textures</p> <p> 22:56:44 Jeffrey Gomez: I suspect this was all a front to advertise their little code shop.</p> <p> 22:56:47 Talarus Luan: ANYone can put up adcubes</p> <p> 22:57:09 Talarus Luan: It takes a real marketing company to understand placement, demographics, etc.</p> <p> 22:57:23 Timo Daehlie: ethycs..</p> <p> 22:57:26 Herne Diker: are their demographics in SL</p> <p> 22:57:28 Talarus Luan: Yup</p> <p> 22:57:36 Esther Merryman: yes</p> <p> 22:57:40 Jeffrey Gomez: To be fair, they're positioned properly. Not with the consumption, granted, but with the tards that fund it.</p> <p> 22:57:46 Esther Merryman: its common sense though</p> <p> 22:58:03 Esther Merryman: high traffic areas</p> <p> 22:58:24 Esther Merryman: near similar items</p> <p> 22:58:26 Jeffrey Gomez: I think if you gave the people funding this real marketing for their dollar, they'd drop most TAG outlets like a sack of shit.</p> <p> 22:58:39 Rem Nightfire: ok got to run folks good meeting again lets keep plugging</p> <p> 22:58:42 Esther Merryman: its not rocket science</p> <p> 22:58:47 Timo Daehlie: take care rem</p> <p> 22:58:52 Rem Nightfire: bye all</p> <p> 22:58:54 MaCelia Morane: by rem</p> <p> 22:58:56 Herne Diker: bye rem'</p> <p> 22:58:57 Talarus Luan: Aye. :) Back to Jack's this Wednesday. I may not be there, but I will try.</p> <p> 22:59:01 rm Sirbu: bye rem</p> <p> 22:59:02 Drongle McMahon: bye rem</p> <p> 22:59:04 Mandrake Araw: byebye</p> <p> 22:59:09 Rem Nightfire: ill go talarus</p> <p> 22:59:12 Esther Merryman: bye rem</p> <p> 22:59:13 Talarus Luan: Thanks for coming, everyone, and keep up the fight! :D</p> <p> 22:59:18 Esther Merryman: take care</p> <p> 22:59:28 Kyrion Yalin: bye Rem</p> <p> 22:59:42 Jeffrey Gomez: It's kinda hard to make it to SL and do an impromptu roadtrip.</p> <p> 22:59:50 Esther Merryman: how is jack acting regarding the issue
===== Close Log 2008-07-13T22:59:54.310780Z =====